Posts by Expugnare

  • PC on OS q8 crystalline sword

    This isn't even close to max. While recent posts have somewhat opened my eyes to how crazy this market is and how willing people are to pay for stuff, this is not max, imperfect and not even prenerf.

    I suppose I won't say merch? I just think getting 100e is gonna be tough. Aim for 10-20.

  • Closed

    Don't you think the Cele could go much higher easily?

    Not to be rude but I've seen absolute dogshit items sell for 15a (singlemod prenerf staves anyone)?

    40a isn't that high by comparison.

  • Closed

    Merch both :D

    Jk, I agree with blink and I think it could go to that level without much difficulty

    The Magmas is tougher, as the mods are meh, but it's still a Q8 Magmas. I would say it can reach like 25-30a with potential for more.

    Hopefully more people give their PCs on these though!

  • todays market

    Here's what I think--customizing an item is a symbol of dedication. It indicates that you aren't in it for the money. It might change the market, but I seriously doubt people who do it care about how it hits the market. Uncustod items are like liquid wealth. Custod items are inert from an economic POV.

    Also they make you somewhat safer from hacks :P

  • todays market

    Okay I've got some free time, so I'm going to address Kromp's points in turn, cause I actually only have a slightly nuanced difference in opinion from him. However two nota benes before I do-- (1) it's hoard, not horde; a maniacal army of Q8 +5e swords and axes are not preparing to sweep through the undefended farmlands :P, and (2) attacking someone's person and character (even via generalized implication) rather than their argument is frankly childish, and something both people arguing have done. I repeat, take it somewhere else, like the PMs.

    Moving on then--

    HI Kromp. Welcome back, please stay longer, we miss you god damn.

    (A) To address your first point, I should have clarified that in saying market manipulation is close to impossible via PC, I meant that strictly in regards to the current market. Some people have insinuated that the reason that items which previously would be considered terrible are selling for multiple sets of FoW armor is because PCers have created a culture of overvaluation. This is simply put wrong, poorly supported and as close to mudslinging as you can get in a context like this. Most importantly it vastly overexaggerates the importance, vitality and influence of Legacy and it's PCers.

    (B) I think you're slightly missing the point with my argument on artificial scarcity. I largely agree with Surge because he recognizes that creating an item drought is only possible with comparatively matching demand. The only way it can happen, though, bolsters your own point--the item can't be that rare to begin with. The reasons hammers isn't a great example is that (1) you're right, they're rarer by a wide margin than Canthan staves for example; but also (2) there's low demand. And honestly, rarity and price manipulation are antithetical other than very rare, discrete examples. The reason for this is that (truly) very rare items are probably too rare to have high associated demand. Y'all must remember watching Q8+5e swords all being bought for 50-100e, then being sold for 100-500e? This wasn't just one trader, at least three had banked up the widely available population of these items and then repackaged them. People paid high prices because these are popular items, regardless of their actual rarity which as a set of mods isn't extraordinary. What you have to remember is that for an item to be hoardable and manipulatiable it has to be rare, but not insanely rare. It has to be mass marketable after all--let's take my or Oofus or Ikkis collection of Fire Ele Wand, even if we had basically all existing Q8 Fire Wands we couldn't price fix because (1) no one gives a fuck about Wands and (2) mods are not uniform throughout, because Wands and offhands are Inherently about 10x rarer than any generic pre nerf martial weapon. On the other hand, something like Canthan staves are an example of something with easy enough and uniform mod set (20/20). Because they're
    not so rare, and had artificially limited supply with high demand, they're a great and easy market to manipulate. . I would know--I've had all of them and personally seen the items face fluctuating value as collections filled. So I suppose I should have clarified, I did not and would never imply that you or Kabong created an artificial hammer scarcity. And, moreover, if you did there is not enough of a market to have it matter. That's why I think Surge is a bit off base RE dual reduc, but I am not a subject matter expert, so I'll let that slide.

    That's all to say this--if 20/20 Wands were as common as 20/20 staves, they'd be much easier to value inflate. You just can't do it with something ultra rare. It's contingent on a lot of things being sold at certain prices to create demand.

    Anyway, I still maintain the biggest culprit for such rampant price inflation is botting and ingame gold buying. But Ikki is right, even indirectly, most active collectors and traders have benefited from this fact. I would never have gotten my Q9 20/20 Fire Dragon if people didn't bot them like crazy (salty as I am that so many people have it now....), no one would be selling items like Q8 bows for 200a unless gold buyers had spiked the economy, etc. Hell, even beyond that a lot of great items were only made available to their owners via hacking, or trade mod fuckery, etc. My disagreement with Ikki is that I unequivocally think that despite the clear benefits, this stuff really hurts the game. Most people, I think, agree and wish it would stop.

    Anyway I doubt we have many real solutions available but I sure do like talking it out on the forums :D

  • todays market

    Sorry Ikki and Max, you're both wrong and honestly acting childish.

    Neither of you are able to manipulate the market, and it's pretty stupid to suggest that it's possible via PC.

    Surge is right about basically everything he posted (other than a Pokémon being better than GW). The reality is that the only legit example of market manipulation is (1) hoarding of Q8 caster swords/axes from a couple years ago, and potentially (2) botting of Canthan staves. Market manipulation, if possible in his game, is only able to be done via selling. That way the ones that control the supply (via hoarding or botting) can set prices for the items. There are probably other examples of hoarding/artificially limited supply, but none have ever had actual demand to pair with them (for example dual reduc, caster shields or hammers).

    Current market conditions have very little to do with either of the people arguing here, so take it somewhere else.

  • todays market

    It's not and can't be market manipulation when it's a niche item.

    Market manipulation only works in broad categories because there is demand--case in point Q8 +5e Swords and axes.

    Unless you mean the overvaluing of prenerf staves/etc in general, but that comes down to age and botting imo. You definitely can't ascribe market condition to one person or even a group, outside of discrete examples like Q8 +5e weaps or botting devaluing Canthan staves.

    Also I think Ikkis argument only makes sense in terms of -2/-2 if he's arguing artificial scarcity via hoarding ? But I guess that could apply to something as big as Hammers too, with someone like Kabong; of me with fire items.

    To me that is not market manipulation.

  • todays market

    Bids give you a ballpark of interest that you can use to create a buyout.

    Otherwise why even have our bidding process at all. . .

    It's all about creating and gauging interest to meet those two numbers I referenced.

  • todays market

    People have brought this up before me, but fundamentally price checks on anything nonstandard is of very very middling usefulness. Especially in current economy.

    A BDS and Cele compass might have fixed prices, maybe even a 20/20 staff. Anything other than that goes by two things, and two things alone:

    (1) what buyer will pay
    (2) what seller will accept

    There is nothing else to it. A price check is an estimation of what you think a potential buyer will pay, and what you think a potential seller will accept. This is going to vary based on your own likes and wants. It is going to vary by what is popular and what isn't. It is going to vary by demand and supply. But fundamentally all PCing does is propose a number for what I listed.

    When there is a very niche item, sometimes the answer is not "I don't know" sometimes the answer is "I know it's worth something, by no one can tel you what, so jus wait and See."

    And sometimes, what a seller wants doesn't comport with what market of buyers will pay. This doesn't even have to be the case for Q8 crystas; just look at Ikkis 20/20 Death offhand. Imo that's worth way more than 750e. The fact that it has no takers says buyers think otherwise.

    The end all be all of this is that PCing is a horribly inexact art, especially nowadays.

  • PC Q7 Celestial Shield single mod

    Nah no way. Y'all are blowing this way out of proportion.

    This item is trash, maybe not merchfood but it's not worth anything.

    200-300e is 2arms, a set of FOW armor, multiple Tormented weapons. Whatver you want to use as a value benchmark.

    This is worth like 10e even now a day.

  • PC on Colossal Scimitar r9

    Agree with above, but I think it's closer to 10e.

    RE the Q8 items you posted:

    Chaos Axe +13%^50 -- imo this can get up to 15a
    Shadow Blade (no extra stats) -- not sure, very dependent on interest
    Vertebreaker +14% damage while in a stance -- probably up to 15a, maybe more
    Glaius +15% damage while enchanted -- great mods, I'd say this is worth 20a
    Exaulted Aegis +28hp--not sure, hard to find buyer

    Hope this helps

    Yuko

  • Your Beloved Collections

    Not too long ago, a friend let me know about an amazing, Q7 Golden Chalice that one of his friends had.

    I got into contact with that friend, and we talked about items for a while. He explained it didn't really fit into his collection, but he had had the item forever, and it was pretty special. I showed him my stuff, we talked, and after a while I had to go soon. Before I did, he did something amazing . . . He GAVE me the item.

    Flummoxed, I thanked him and offered to pay, but he refused, saying it deserved to be part of a good home.

    It really was pretty amazing.

    Flash forward a few weeks, and I got a PM from a guy I had messaged a few time on guru about selling another Q7 offhand. After what I'm sure were many annoying PMs from me, he agreed to sell it for the price I offered, because he had seen some of the stuff I posted, and decided the offhand deserved to be in a good home.

    These two items are pretty special to me. They're matching, gold Q7 Energy Storage, 12 energy, 9% HSR / Ar^5 Golden Chalices. They even have matching gold values of 136!

    I've never had two items that are so insanely rare also be so insanely well matched.

    I joined the two Q7 sets with Q8 Fire wands that befit their awesomeness. In particular, I really like the 20 HSR 9 HCT paired with -20 HP 9HCT (yay matching numbers). The other Q7 is joined by the first fire item I ever had, a Q8 Wayward.

    I'm posting the offhands here with the wands that will accompany them, along with some other of my favorite wand / offhand sets. I have a lot of other Q8 and higher wands, but these ones pair really well with the offhands here. You should see themes in the pairing of these items. Q12s will be with Q12s, 19% with 19%, 9% with 9% and so on. I like numbers that matchup. Also, both Flame artifacts on the right side are Eye skins

    QRH4XDW.jpg

    Big thanks to Ikki, Yami, Ivory and MrFancylad, who really made this whole thing possible, and to all those who helped me find some of the other stuff you see here.

    Y'all make this game amazing!

    [PhD] Yuko