BiP support

  • This is a balanced setup for use with any player build. It provides very strong spikes and decent ability to push kills thanks to a mesmer midline. Blood is Power is used to consolidate the energy management of the team, freeing up skill slots to be used for more offense and support.

    Note that this team is intended to comfortably and efficiently complete missions, dungeons, and vanquishes - for elite areas, it is highly recommended to modify the builds. It's assumed that you won't be relying on any consumables, but of course it will only make the team stronger if you do pop them. This team does not require any mercenary heroes or Zei Ri. If you have those, it's worth making considerable improvements (specifically, adding more mesmers).

    Any build will work for the player, but it should ideally be focused on DPS. The heroes provide the necessary shutdown and support for most areas of the game. BiP means that you needn't rely on your own energy management, but remember that it's not infinite free energy, and AI won't use it on a martial profession wielding a martial weapon (so if you're a sin, derv, warr, para, or ranger, swap to a staff to get a BiP).

    If you choose to play melee (e.g. dagger spam), the first hero should bring Strength of Honor.

    Since these heroes have no source of Deep Wound, such a skill can be a valuable addition to the player bar.

    Set all the heroes to Guard Guard mode.

    ESurge 1 for melee player

    Only bring this hero if you are attacking with a melee weapon.

    [build=OQNTAQB705EkDmemuhAOdeIAA]

    Disable Strength of Honor and micro it on yourself, as well as a melee summon if you have one.

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Domination Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Major Fast Casting

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    2x Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Domination Magic set

    ESurge 1 for non-melee player

    Only bring this hero if you are NOT attacking with a melee weapon.

    [build=OQhkAsC8gFKzJIHM9MdjQcaG4iB]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Domination Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Major Fast Casting

    Rune of Minor Inspiration Magic

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Domination Magic set

    ESurge 2

    [build=OQhkAsC8gFKyJkDTvpPEERGcxA]

    Swap in Panic for really difficult areas/quests that may need more enemy shutdown. (DoA/UW/WoC for example)

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Domination Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Major Fast Casting

    Rune of Minor Inspiration Magic

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Domination Magic set

    ESurge 3

    [build=OQBTAyQKY6EIHY6x0ZIIPDBkEA]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Domination Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Fast Casting

    Rune of Minor Illusion Magic

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Domination Magic set


    For a more aggressive setup, drop a point from Fast Casting and put it in Illusion Magic; change both the minor runes to major. This improves the Illusion skills by ~15% at the cost of 70 health.

    BiP Resto

    [build=OAhkQkG4RFyzdoqO0GnSzh5kzOA]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Blood Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Soul Reaping
    Rune of Minor Curses

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Restoration Magic set is optimal, although the hero will be holding PwK the majority of the time.

    ST Ritualist

    [build=OAmjAyiIpOYTrX48xBNRuYMnJ]

    Micro the hero to place spirits ahead of dangerous encounters, where they won't get killed by the enemies, but still in spirit range of where your team will be.

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Communing on the headpiece

    Rune of Superior Spawning Power

    Rune of Major Channeling Magic

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    Rune of Attunement

    5x Radiant Insignia

    Hale Staff of Fortitude with "Don't Think Twice" inscription - DO NOT be tempted to use a spear - this will cause the hero to run closer to enemies than the rest of the heroes due to lower range, and "Avoid Combat" may also cause it to run closer to enemies when trying to kite melee.

    BSurge

    [build=OghjgwMYoSXVfDeDhDSTDTTOLgA]

    Replace Lightning Strike with Aura of Restoration for areas where more healing is required.

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Air Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Energy Storage

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    2x Rune of Vitae

    5x Survivor Insignia

    40/40 Air Magic set

    MM

    [build=OAljUwGpZSbhVVUBfBKg8Y7YCAA]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Death Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Soul Reaping

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    2x Rune of Attunement

    1x Bloodstained Insignia on head, gloves, or shoes

    4x Radiant Insignia

    40/40 Death Magic set

    WTB pcons


    IGN: Shadow Of The Owls

    Edited 6 times, last by Misty ().

  • 6-man

    In 6-man areas, kick the BSurge and MM. Change the ESurge 2 to this:

    [build=OQlkAgC8QZmzJIHM9MdDBiQGYHD]

    Change the BiP to this:

    [build=OAhjQkGZIP3hq6QbcKNHmTukL]

    As a caster player, you can replace Blood Bond with Soothing Memories.

    If you don't want Splinter Weapon (i.e. you're playing as a caster), change the ST to this:[build=OAmjAykpZOYTrX48xBNRu7YnJ]

    If you are keeping Splinter Weapon but still want 2 copies of "Fall Back!", also change the ESurge 1 to this:[build=OQljAkCsZOngcw0z0NEwp7YBA]

    For that build, Minor Fast Casting makes more sense than Major, but the 35 health difference is not worth worrying about for just a few missions.

    4-man

    For 4-man, BiP support becomes much less effective, so it is highly recommended to run a different team there.


    WTB pcons


    IGN: Shadow Of The Owls

    Edited once, last by Misty ().

  • Invoke

    In the handful of areas with very few available corpses or extreme counters to minions (e.g. Ooze Pit), you can replace the MM with another elementalist:

    [build=OgljgwMpZOAalm3IcYMq37YcM]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Air Magic on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Energy Storage

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    2x Rune of Vitae

    5x Survivor Insignia

    40/40 Air Magic set

    Koss

    In Venta Cemetery and Jennur's Horde, replace the MM with Koss. This build also works fine for Chahbek Village.

    [build=OQATERqW5htwVQsAGDDPZqJAA]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Tactics on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Strength

    Rune of Minor Swordsmanship

    Rune of Superior Absorption

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    5x Brawler's Insignia

    a Vampiric Sword of Fortitude with "Strength and Honor" inscription and Aegis of Aaaaarrrrrrggghhh are great, but realistically it's probably too much effort to equip Koss beyond the basic runes, so you can just steal Jora's weapons - they are better than his.

    Margrid the Sly

    In Pogahn Passage and Dasha Vestibule, replace the BSurge with Margrid.

    [build=OgUTI4BjnxnmD6BmuMwFA5IAA]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Minor Wilderness Survival on the headpiece

    3x Rune of Attunement

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    5x Radiant Insignia

    Insightful Staff of Fortitude with "Hale and Hearty" inscription... or just give her a random staff or keep her crappy longbow.

    General Morgahn

    In Ruins of Morah, replace the MM with Morgahn. Don't forget to set him to Guard Guard mode so he doesn't run around getting extra aggro. Bring Spoil Victor on the necro BiP.

    [build=OQSkQglo5imj7+Oojtwj4asPGHD]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Command on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Leadership

    Rune of Minor Spear Mastery

    Rune of Attunement

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    5x Radiant Insignia

    Furious Spear of Enchanting with "I have the power!" inscription and Stygian Defender

    Dunkoro/Tahlkora

    In Blacktide Den, Consulate Docks, Moddok Crevice, Grand Court of Sebelkeh, and Gate of Pain, replace the BSurge with the appropriate monk hero.

    [build=OwAT04nB3xLuRm+3N/xddlspB]

    Equipment:

    Rune of Superior Healing Prayers on the headpiece

    Rune of Minor Divine Favor

    Rune of Minor Protection Prayers

    Rune of Attunement

    best Vigor rune you can afford

    5x Radiant Insignia

    Adept Healing Staff of Enchanting with "Aptitude Not Attitude" inscription


    Melonni

    ComingSoon™! In the meantime, this build is pretty okay:

    [build=OgCjkqrMLOfbzL3XczeFwjXnL]

    WTB pcons


    IGN: Shadow Of The Owls

    Edited 5 times, last by Misty ().

  • Come on Misty, a minion master? And why is there no ineptitude but three esurges, that will drain enemies to 0 energy before they die often.

    IGN: Mystical Dub.

  • Come on Misty, a minion master? And why is there no ineptitude but three esurges, that will drain enemies to 0 energy before they die often.

    Because 3 esurges are better than 2 esurges and an ineptitude. Hence why they transitioned into bsurge ele. I still use 2 esurge hybrids and ineptitude hybrid on my mesmer. 3 esurges are not going to drain every enemies energy down to 0 energy. and if they somehow magically did do that before they died, then they are no longer using skills! there for making them much easier to kill.

  • Because 3 esurges are better than 2 esurges and an ineptitude. Hence why they transitioned into bsurge ele. I still use 2 esurge hybrids and ineptitude hybrid on my mesmer. 3 esurges are not going to drain every enemies energy down to 0 energy. and if they somehow magically did do that before they died, then they are no longer using skills! there for making them much easier to kill.

    Except for melee enemies such as warriors. And shit, I've drained enemies to 0 energy before killing them with esurge plenty of times with only 2 mesmers in the party. Do you play without consets or headpieces or what? But even if they didn't fall to 0 energy, Ineptitude deals more damage than Esurge.

    IGN: Mystical Dub.

  • Except for melee enemies such as warriors. And shit, I've drained enemies to 0 energy before killing them with esurge plenty of times with only 2 mesmers in the party. Do you play without consets or headpieces or what? But even if they didn't fall to 0 energy, Ineptitude deals more damage than Esurge.

    I don't generally do simple content with a conset. I might pop one if it's a very very large area to vanq or if I'm doing elite content. But even then I never have issues of my esurges do no damage. Sure there might be some moments in fights if every esurge hits the same exact enemy, the one following might not do damage. But that's rare. Ineptitude had a higher number. But with the higher energy cost, requirement for it to go off, and illusion skills just being overall weaker than Dom ones, you cant say this specific team comp is worse just by the fact it has another es than inept. However feel free to test it yourself and see which you like more. Testing done by multiple community members has deemed this to be better without mercs. The air ele is good for anti melee as was inept, it may not do as much as inept but combined with airs armor pen as melees will have more armor than casters anyways, and the extra over all damage and cc from the esurge mesmer, this was what it's evolved to. Like I said, I still use 2 es 1 inept and clear content fine but I have tried this and it's worked a little better in general. I just play mostly on my Mesmer so there's 3 esurges already. And I still rarely ecounter the very very rare chance of my esurge doing no damage

  • I don't generally do simple content with a conset. I might pop one if it's a very very large area to vanq or if I'm doing elite content. But even then I never have issues of my esurges do no damage. Sure there might be some moments in fights if every esurge hits the same exact enemy, the one following might not do damage. But that's rare. Ineptitude had a higher number. But with the higher energy cost, requirement for it to go off, and illusion skills just being overall weaker than Dom ones, you cant say this specific team comp is worse just by the fact it has another es than inept. However feel free to test it yourself and see which you like more. Testing done by multiple community members has deemed this to be better without mercs. The air ele is good for anti melee as was inept, it may not do as much as inept but combined with airs armor pen as melees will have more armor than casters anyways, and the extra over all damage and cc from the esurge mesmer, this was what it's evolved to. Like I said, I still use 2 es 1 inept and clear content fine but I have tried this and it's worked a little better in general. I just play mostly on my Mesmer so there's 3 esurges already. And I still rarely ecounter the very very rare chance of my esurge doing no damage

    Well, you'll get f'd in the butt if you attempt uw without anti melee. Energy cost for Ineptitude is negligible since there's a bip and in general the air ele is 100% useless because it deals no damage itself, the bip can easily bring weaken armor and an ineptitude mesmer is more useful in utility. Basically get damage + effects from the third esurge and the bsurge combined in one and have a free slot to waste. You can (and should, minion master is arguably the worst build to ever bring anywhere) also replace the second necro with a HBurst/Spell Breaker Monk or a damage necro with 3 resto skills such as the BSurge here.


    But admittedly, my criticism is useless now considering the OP was edited to state that the build is for regular gameplay in normal mode. I'd still get rid of the minion master, kick the ST and stack more damage instead, but that's just preference. And then again, in elite areas I use only one ESurge, one Ineptitude and one Panic.

    IGN: Mystical Dub.

    Edited 2 times, last by dubbleclick ().

  • But admittedly, my criticism is useless now considering the OP was edited to state that the build is for regular gameplay in normal mode. I'd still get rid of the minion master, kick the ST and stack more damage instead, but that's just preference. And then again, in elite areas I use only one ESurge, one Ineptitude and one Panic.

    This is not for normal mode at all. It might require some tweaking for end-game content (WoC HM, UW HM, DoA HM) but it can handle the rest of HM without a problem. The minion master has proved to be an extremely strong damage dealer while still providing the x2 33% IMS that we considered a must have.


    Well, you'll get f'd in the butt if you attempt uw without anti melee.


    This guy disagrees with you.


    Basically get damage + effects from the third esurge and the bsurge combined in one and have a free slot to waste.

    A simple test with toolblox damage meter will show you that E-surge does SIGNIFICANTLY more damage than Ineptitude. Ineptitude builds are only valuable for the blind and arcane conundrum. In terms of raw damage E-surge eats them alive. You also lose a lot in terms of caster shut down.


    So no, you are not getting the effects of the E-surge at all. The energy concerns are fair, but even if enemies get drained some times (which would only happen very rarely) E-surge still wins in damage. The only places where Ineptitude might win is where there is almost a total absence of casters (Arachni comes to mind)


    The air ele is 100% useless because it deals no damage itself, the bip can easily bring weaken armor and an ineptitude mesmer is more useful in utility.

    The air ele is there to provide the second copy of resto skills and pack the blind lost from the lack of ineptitude. It also deals a decent amount of damage (checked with toolbox damage meter) and is able to fill in some utitily, so I would say it fills its role pretty nicely.

  • ESurge is still amazing in Arachni's - even if there weren't plenty of high energy targets (which there are), there are so many mobs that it's essentially impossible to drain them all. You also definitely want the Mistrust against all that Snaring Web.

  • Thanks for making this guide! Here are some of my thoughts and opinions about the skills in your team build based on my experiences using 7-hero teams to clear hard content: DoA, UW, hard mode EotN dungeons, etc. I'm not expecting you to drop everything and change your builds based only on my feedback, but more discussion can't hurt! :)


    ST Rit
    I prefer Signet of Creation over Boon of Creation for ST prot heroes as energy management. Boon makes the hero lag behind the party a lot of the time due to the 2s casting time and if they recast it mid-combat, you've lost most of any energy savings you might have had. It's also one of the few enchantments on your team, making it likely to be stripped in a lot of cases anyway.


    I'm not a fan of the low level Splinter Weapon. The skill is amazing at level 16, but at 10 I don't think it's worth splitting your stats over. I'd rather use a couple slots on my ST prot for monk-based hex removal (and swap the Shatter Hexes to something more generally useful).

    Mesmers
    I've found Hex Eater Signet and Shatter Hex to be poor primary hex removal skills. Touch skills effectively add 1-2s to their casting time as the hero spends time running around and the hero AI does not use Shatter to prevent the effect of hexes, only when it will deal damage to the enemy, which can matter if you are not melee. Additionally, shatter costs 10e, which drains more of your resources than necessary if you just swapped in a couple monk-based hex clearing skills in their place.

    I also think half-cast portion of 40/40 sets don't add much to your dps when you're hitting 13+ FC since at that level you're spending more time in after-cast animation (locked at 3/4s) than actually casting your spells, at least with hero AI being what it is. I prefer running Insightful Staves of Fortitude (inscr can be "Apt not Att" to keep some casting time reduction or "Hale and Hearty" to boost energy even more) to help limit the burden on your BiP battery. The generic recharge reduction will also work on any secondary Inspiration or Illusion skills on the bars, which is a nice benefit.


    I prefer Signet of Return over FoMF as a hard res because while the res target ends up revived at roughly the same HP either way, the signet has no energy cost nor drains HP from the caster. There are obviously situations where FoMF will work better, but SoR is a viable alternative.


    Minion Master
    I'd really like to fit Stand Your Ground in here as a option for players not running Save Yourselves. Boosting your party's armor by +24 is really good and you've got the attributes and energy for it.


    B-Surge Ele
    I'd recommend offering Thunderclap as a variant elite for caster heavy missions/dungeons/zones. Not getting to take advantage of the 40/40 air set most of the time due to Protective was Kaolai makes me sad, but I'm not sure what the alternative is.

    Invoke Lightning alternate for MM
    I'd recommend a Ray of Justice monk in this slot (at the very least as an option) since many of the areas where a MM is bad are filled with undead that make smiting monks great. RoJ monks may be a tier behind E-Surge, but I think they're still effective heroes.


    If you're set on keeping an ele, I think I'd rather have Thunderclap + Chain Lightning for hybrid disruption and damage or Elemental Attunement Fire Magic for pure damage over Invoke, at least since the changes to overcast on these skills.

    Margrid
    I get that rangers are not top tier heroes, but they can dish out some strong single target DPS with Enraged Lunge or Strike as One builds that should be better than a random assortment of mes interrupts.

    Edited once, last by Rihanna ().