One thing I really Dislike about GW1

1st Official Post

    The paper-thin character progression. By that I mean power progression, stuff that actually makes you grow in power.

    Every time I think about coming back, I'm reminded that no matter how much I farm and no matter how much gold I have, I won't become any more powerful than I was soon after hitting lvl 20- which is a very short-lived milestone in itself.

    I'm actually quite curious as to what people do with all their gold. The game seems to have reached a point where 99.99% of players know all the best farms and basically want for nothing and so there is nothing to stimulate trade. In fact, the only thing you ever see on trade are bots selling Z-keys. I wouldn't mind this so much if there was a goal I could set that would make some tangible difference for my toons. But there is nothing like this beyond some title track skills. I just can't find the motivation to play it anymore because there is nothing meaningful to aim for.

    I find it really hard to maintain enthusiasm for farming when the only thing I have to gain from it is the act of farming itself, as the rewards are more or less meaningless. It just really saddens me that despite all the great content in this game, the progression ceiling will always remain very shallow. It's both funny and sad when you think about how there is basically no power differential between a fresh 20 and a lvl 20 with 7k hours dedicated to it. One just "looks" better.

    For me, that low ceiling is exactly why I like GW. Instead of mindlessly grinding mods for a +1 trait or incrementally better gear, the progression comes from learning each area, it's mobs, and playing your own skillbars better. Much more satisfying personally, and also means it's much quicker to get alt characters up and running.

    You could always start a new character - that will likely give you plenty of reason to farm. You're right though, most people have all they need in the game now (outside of high-end collectors). Just play the game for it's own sake - the gameplay is still fun after all.

    IGN: I Casamir I

    Quote from gwdeepee

    For me, that low ceiling is exactly why I like GW. Instead of mindlessly grinding mods for a +1 trait or incrementally better gear, the progression comes from learning each area, it's mobs, and playing your own skillbars better. Much more satisfying personally, and also means it's much quicker to get alt characters up and running.

    You could always start a new character - that will likely give you plenty of reason to farm. You're right though, most people have all they need in the game now (outside of high-end collectors). Just play the game for it's own sake - the gameplay is still fun after all.

    I get where you are coming from. The build system is the one thing that defines the game for me. Probably explains why I never got into GW2. But I also feel that they could have added more depth for gear progression. We could still enjoy learning builds and area's independent of that. I don't really see an issue with grinding for gear, we mindlessly grind for everything else in the game as it is. That's basically GW in a nutshell. We just grind for mostly trivial things like vanity. Personally, I find gear progression much more gratifying than a title that typically represents hundreds, if not thousands of hours doing very mundane things.

    I guess it really doesn't matter now anyway, it's not like the game will ever get a major update at this point. I just hope they make GW3 in GW1's image. And maybe gear progression that doesn't reach it's pinnacle in just a week of playing.

    Quote from Fleebusia

    I don't really see an issue with grinding for gear, we mindlessly grind for everything else in the game as it is. That's basically GW in a nutshell. We just grind for mostly trivial things like vanity. Personally, I find gear progression much more gratifying than a title that typically represents hundreds, if not thousands of hours doing very mundane things.

    The thing is, outside of reputation titles (and their skills) all of that grind is optional. Whereas if the power scaling goes on much longer, and the enemies are scaled to that higher power level, not only is that a lot of grinding which can't be avoided, but it is also duplicated across every (new) character.

    I appreciate gear grinds when it introduces a new playstyle, but not when it just increases health +60 or what have you - which is how most games seem to implement it these days. Anniversary weapons are the type of end-game gear grind which would appeal to me, although I appreciate that grind isn't required.

    Agree to disagree on this one I think! :)

    IGN: I Casamir I

    Lack of vertical progression is a large part of why I love GW1. Having to grind to unlock mechanical benefits sucks.

    The economy is dead because the game itself is essentially automated and no longer actively maintained. It has little to do with lack of leveling.

    I can just agree with pre posters. That u can get a max char in like a week ready to play a lot of speed clears, farms and such is what is really nice. Playing for titles or cosmetics is what I enjoy. I know there are games Wich increase the max dmg of weapons with each update so u have to buy new add-ons to level your chat 10 level further and to get +100dps on the new raid drops. This system is not for me and never enjoyed such games. Also why I didn't came in touch with GW2. Also to come back to the game is way cooler when u just can make a new chat and in week u can play all the stuff u like with a new class and just tinker around a little. Also all, our old chars are still "max power", even after years of not playing. Instead of now having to grind 1 year just to get a at least playable chars again for the new meta Wich would be the case for the other Game design Wich allways increases weapon dmg and levels over each campaign/Update/add on. Over all I would say the part u dislike the most is why the most people love it with the bottom of their hearts 💕

    But the good thing for you is. Most Games don't share the gw1 system and rather follow the WoW approach on a MMO so u got plenty of other games to fullfil ur "grinding and powerincrease dreams" in :)

    This thread is an echo chamber really, and I can only contribute to said echoes! most people here will have played for so many years because participating in content wasn’t hidden behind this sort of progression.

    Apologies if this just a repeat of the above…

    The only other MMO I have played is gw2. Things started to go wrong there when I had to grind for hours just to get the stat set I wanted for a build, doing really banal collection of resources, just to play. In contrast it’s easy to get a new char to max level, with max gear in gw1. Then the only progression requirement is to get to the outpost where your chosen content takes place - you can either get a run, or you can play the game through. Like do fighting and quests and stuff, play the story. Maybe get a nice drop along the way. But then you have experienced how to play the profession, levelled up and geared your heroes, and unlocked the map - pretty serious improvements for a character. Comparing my main’s heroes during my first vanquish compared to my last on the way to legendary vq, a huge amount of progression and power increase too place through hero composition changes, build editing, and learning new tactics happened along the way without ever having to increase my armor or weapon values. In this regard making a new character and progressing them is a subtly much more serious endeavour that just levelling to 20. Of course progression like this will trail off after 7k hours, but I reckon a good few hundred can be taken over this process playing in an average way.

    Other progression is optional and largely cosmetic, but it’s something you can tackle organically over time without the fear of obsolescence.

    I have 4.5k hours in this game, and remarkably few of them have been doing repetitive nonsense just so I can experiment with a new build.

    I also kind of like the fact I can still get my ass handed to me on my main by 4-man area VQs or 6-man missions periodically if my build/team selection isn’t great, or I make a bad pull or don’t know the area patrols too well, in the knowledge I can swap things around without having to grind out a new set of gear to make me ‘more powerful’.

    Quote from Jonast

    This thread is an echo chamber

    It might be reasonable to assume the reason for this is closely related to the fact that only the most loyal and die-hard players inhabit these forums and the game itself at this point, instead of 98% of the original player base that left because they realized how shallow and meaningless titles are in the grand scheme on things. You could even say that me coming here to voice such a complaint was ill-conceived, as it's a likeness to going to a fanclub trying to point out flaws in the object of their interest. It was more to vent my frustration but I can understand why nobody here can relate to it.

    This is the main contrast to most other MMO's. You can always come back to it and find something meaningful to progress towards. MMO's like WoW held their appeal to a much larger player base solely because of this. True and persistent character progression was clearly something that appealed to a lot of people. I think the true outlier here is that GW1 does not share the same business model as a traditional subscription-based MMO.

    But I do still respect other people's preferences to how this model should work. I just don't agree with it or care for it. Anyway, this was my last-ditch effort to get back into GW1, so this will likely be the last you ever hear from me. Have fun and enjoy.

    Quote from Fleebusia

    It might be reasonable to assume the reason for this is closely related to the fact that only the most loyal and die-hard players inhabit these forums and the game itself at this point, instead of 98% of the original player base that left because they realized how shallow and meaningless titles are in the grand scheme on things.

    If you think gw1 isn't a good game or worth playing then what are you doing posting on gw1 forums about how bad the game is? Go play wow or whatever 🤷‍♂️

    Edited once, last by Kryth Vocans (June 16, 2021 at 9:37 PM).

    Quote from Fleebusia

    This is the main contrast to most other MMO's. You can always come back to it and find something meaningful to progress towards.

    I fully get your perspective - gw1 isn’t the game you really want to play because it doesn’t suit your view of long term progression. I think everyone here gets that your comments aren’t a criticism of the game per se. Many of us have the reverse perspective of other MMOs which is shown in our comments. I certainly don’t hate gw2 for example, and would like to enjoy it, but I find it very hard to come back to - raids, fractals seem locked behind having to get a new gearset. The latest open world stuff requires me to rush through the story to get to the latest money making farm, to fund this. These things appeal to some people, but not to me and it would seem most of the commenters here.

    I’ll offer a response to the above quote though. Gw1 for me has always been a slow burn. Working towards legendary vq, legendary guardian, were meaningful things that took a couple of years of quitting and coming back to get to. I have 99% tyrian cartographer despite being at 95% in 2007. I only did WoC and WiK on my main a couple of years ago. I spent 7 months trying to do rescue at minister chos HM without consumables or stones (I did succeed, with warriors cunning and way of the fox on my bar no less. I also got to the last group with flourish on my bar and failed LOL). The point being I haven’t rushed anything, so there was never a void of content that needed to be filled by a gear treadmill. Just playing the game was enough between the times I spent doing titles. So in a sense I did always have something meaningful to come back to; challenging content of old stories I enjoyed, and new stories I hadn’t played when they first came out.

    • Official Post

    The game is fun to play and NOT having to contend with trying to get the best stuff to do the job is part of the reason why people enjoy it so much. Once you have reached that max level you can then work on other parts of the game like elite areas, hard mode, (some) dungeons etc. Not having to worry that you arent strong enough to battle through and actually enjoying PLAYING the game.

    Part of why I disliked gw2 was due to the very high top level and the _need_ to have even better equipment, it makes it almost impossible for a new player to ever get to the end (is there an end?). I want to accomplish something --this makes me feel like I have completed something, not continuing to never get to the finish line.

    :mouse:where is the 'all you can eat' cookie bar? :cookie: