• Official Post

    Been long overdue that the "Truth about Prenerf" thread was revamped, so here it is. Have broken this down into 4 sections, see Shields & Focus / Greens / Runes & Miscellaneous

    Everything here is subject to change and additions. If you can see a mistake or notice something is missing please say so and it shall be changed. The goal here is to use community collective knowledge to get as close to the truth as possible.

    An item is considered Pre-Nerf if it cannot drop anymore. In other words, the possibility of the game generating these stats or items has been physically removed by the coders at Anet, mainly 2005/2006 around the release of Factions. The only way to acquire Pre-Nerf items is through trading with other players.

    The following list is items / mods that are observably no longer in the game, not possible because of nerfed foe levels or a known update specifically removed them. It's possible this contains mistakes or is incomplete but it's the best of currently-known knowledge

    Prenerf Weapons:

    All Q7 weapons with current max dmg

    Q7 Swords above 14-21 dmg

    Q7 Axes above 6-25 dmg

    Q7 Hammers above 18-32 dmg

    Q7 Daggers above 7-15 dmg

    Q7 Bows above 14-25 dmg

    Q7 Wands above 11-20 dmg

    Q7 Staffs above 11-20 dmg

    Q8 Staffs with max (11-22) dmg

    Q8 Axes with max (6-28) dmg

    Q8 Hammers with max (19-35) dmg

    Q8 Hammers with (18-35) dmg

    Q8 Dagger with max (7-17) dmg

    Q8 Bows with max (15-28) dmg

    Q8 Bows with (14-28) dmg

    Q8 Wands with max (11-22) dmg

    All Q8 Zodiac swords

    All Q8 Vertebreakers

    Q8 OS Shadow blades - Anybody confirmed Shard wolf exception?

    All unconditional items

    Gold staffs with a requirement of 0

    Staffs with a HSR mod in GOLD text

    Staffs missing HSR Mod completely (Some exceptions still available from collector/quest rewards)

    FACTIONS & Tyrian OS Staffs in restoration req

    GOLD OS Crystalline Swords with an inherent mod

    GOLD OS Dwarven Axes with an inherent mod

    GOLD OS Dwarven Hammers

    GOLD OS Krytan Axes

    All Swamp Clubs

    GOLD OS Serpent Axes in Tyrian Skin

    OS Gold/Purple Fire Staffs in "Dead skin" (Other rarities still available from collectors)

    OS Gold/Purple Water Staffs in "Dead skin" (Other rarities still available from collectors)

    OS staffs with lower dmg than 4-6. Example: q0 2-4, 3-4, 3-5 (Some exceptions still available from collector/quest rewards)

    The Henge of Denravi sword, Axe, Bow and Hammer (details to be added)

    Blue/purple weapons with dual vamp / zeal mod

    Blue/purple weapons with xx/-10 and xx/-5 mod

    Items with an inherit mod instead of an inscription or 3 mods. (See Mausoleum / Triple mod research)

    All Q8 Gold weapons with a gold value higher than 280g

    All Purple inscribable Crystalline Swords

    Any Gold/Purple/blue OS Wand with mixed profession mod (HCT / HSR) on a single profession skin. Mixed profession mod on multi-profession skin are NOT prenerf, this include : Amber Wand, Jade Wand, Platinium Wand, Jellyfish Wand, Koi Scepter, Plagueborn Scepter, Celestial Scepter, Wayward Wand, Zodiac Wand.

    Any Gold/Purple/blue OS Staff with mixed profession mod (HCT/HSR) on a single profession skin. Mixed profession mod on multi-profession skin are NOT prenerf, this include : Ghostly staff, Shadow staff, Amber Staff, Jade Staff, Bo staff, Celestial Staff, Cockatrice Staff, Dragon Staff, Forbidden Staff, Outcast Staff, Plagueborn Staff, Platinum Staff, Zodiac Staff.

    Inherent Gold Weapon mods:

    +13%[condition] or lower

    +18%[while Hexed] or lower

    +18%[below 50%] or lower

    Wands with 18% or lower HSR/HCT mod

    Wands with +3 Energy

    Wands with 8% or lower HSR/HCT

    Wands with 13/-1 or lower

    FACTIONS Wands with a restoration requirement

    Inherent Purple Weapon mods:

    +11 or 12%(condition)

    +xx%/-5 energy, +xx%/-10 armour or +xx%/-1(energy or health) regen

    11-14% While hex.

    11-14% while below 50%.

    Weapon Mods:

    Sundering of 10/9% or lower (Except Sword)

    Furious weapon mod 10/4 or lower

    Any +25% damage vs Charr

    Sword & Axe Vamp with 1-2/ -1

    Hammer & Bow Vamp 1-3/-1

    Example of some Prenerf weapons:

    (If anybody has screenshots of the missing ones please post and I will update.

  • q7 staffs above 11-20 are prenerf (listed above 11-21 here)

    also q8 hammers 18-35 or bows 14-28 are prenerf

    Also some staffs lacking HSR Mod do exist and are still available from collector/quest rewards, so not ALL, but most are prenerf :D

    Also most staffs with lower dmg than 4-6 are prenerf (some q0 2-4, 3-4, 3-5 dmg staffs exist but no longer drop), some 3-5 available from collector/weaponsmith/quest reward

    And well.. every gold q8 weapon/offhand/shield with higher gold value than 280g is prenerf (and for purples there is gold value gap for post nerf too)

    Also, some blue collector/quest reward items (wands atleast) used to drop with wrong requirement (req healing) similar to req healing -50hp cesta

    I also wonder why purple serpent with prenerf mod is listed seperately, as same rule applies to well.. every skin and thats allready listed below :D

    Edited 3 times, last by Pleikki ().

    • Official Post


    That is fantastic stuff, thank you. Have updated list accordingly, will change the image soon.

    Do you have (or could you make ;) ) a list of the collector/weaponsmith/quest reward exceptions to the low dmg and no HSR mod staffs? Would be great to have that somewhere.

    Anymore detail or examples of the collector/quest reward items that dropped wrong req? Need a little more specificity to add it really.

    Well spotted on the purple serpent, not sure why it was on past lists or why I added to this one ^^

  • Hmm, i dont have time to research sadly, even that it shouldnt be that much work..

    Also now spotted blue items with xx/-10 and xx/-5, generally blue+purple have the same system with those and dual vamps so they could be listed together (imo) as now blue dual vamps and purple dual vamps are on seperate lists.

    For the low req/ no HSR staff i can contribute with this


    It's hard to spot the prenerf :D Gold value now shows the collector, as dropped whites dont have gold value unless someone id's them :D

    With this image you also can see.. Water staff/Fire staff with Dead staff skin isnt prenerf with all rarities, some from collector etc exist.

  • Hey some small nitpicks :


    [Attribute mod combos]

    Any Gold/Purple OS Wand or staff with mixed profession mods on single profession skins. (like 20% HCT healing on truncheon, or 1/20 Fire on Jeweled chalice or HCT Inspriation on a Earth Staff) (doesnt apply on multiprofession skins like paper fan)

    Currently the multiprofession focus like the Paper Fan can only drop with mods related to their profession. So if you find a Paper Fan with a mod from a different profession it's definitively prenerf !

    On the other hand the multiprofession wands can currently drop with mods unrelated to their profession, this include :

    - Amber Wand

    - Jade Wand

    - Platinium Wand

    - Jellyfish Wand

    - Koi Scepter

    - Plagueborn Scepter

    - Celestial Scepter

    - Wayward Wand

    - Zodiac Wand

    Also if you need a picture of a Gold wand with <19% HSR or a Single-prof wand with mods unrelated to their profession feel free to use this one. I also have some nice picture to illustrate the prenerf staves with mixed profession req/HSR/HCT if you need to.


    Anymore detail or examples of the collector/quest reward items that dropped wrong req? Need a little more specificity to add it really.

    Many of the quest reward from Prophecies were changed around in late 2005/early 2006. The change can be categorized in 3 different way :

    - Many items got their req changed from a monk req to a req more fitting their class (a well known example of that being the -50hp Grim cesta that was changed from a Req Healing to a Req Blood)

    - Many items got their damage range changed (usually inscreased by 30%)

    - Some items got their stats reworked (example like this one : Link)

    I have screenshot and in game confirmation of at least 10 of those items but I suspect there are many many more out there. Imo all the "prenerf blue" should be separated and given their own sub-section in the same way the "prenerf green" got one.


    The Henge of Denravi sword, Axe, Bow and Hammer (multiple versions exist)

    As far as I understand all the HoD axe with an inherent +25hp have been changed. It would be better to post the "after-change" version instead of posting a picture on an item that just no longer exist in this current form. (Edit to precise i'm only talking about HoD Axe)

    See 25th October 2006 update :


    IGN : Veni Vidi Wiki

    WTB Triple prof wands + Aegis/SotW + Prenerf runes + Sanhan's Staff (here)

    Edited 2 times, last by Oldschool Cool: Edited to clarify I was talking about the HoD axe and not all the HoD in general ().

    • Official Post

    @Oldschool Cool We love nitpicks :)

    I'm thinking a thread should be made of what is possible for wands, focus and staffs currently in regards to profession related mods as a lookup resource. Then everything that doesn't conform to that list can be declared prenerf.

    I saw @Ostona posted in "Does it exist" stuff about the HoD items. Between that, these additional quest reward changes you speak of and dv, dz, xx/-10, xx/-5 a "Blue" thread should absolutely be made. Well volunteered both of you ;)

    PS Ostona. If you are working on a article for Unconditional items for wiki please copy a version to a "Prenerf" thread as the info is a bit sparse and scattered around atm. I made a start on this, will pm you what I have.

  • F, sorry, I didn't see this thread until today, it'll have escaped me between all the notifications, thanks that Pleikki has made a bump and I have seen it on the main page.

    Okay, once I have something I will post it in that sub-forum (I was going to do it anyway though, because I wanted to write something logical and not a simple copy-paste with the information, so it will take a little time).

    I also have to ask the two or three moderators that are active in the wiki if an article with technical information and a list of items can be created as an exception, because normally the articles only have basic and general information, reserving the technical part for the "Discussion" page, such as item drop/research for example. This will probably be linked in the Historical content category, but I also want to create another subcategory for all the pre-nerf stuff, to have everything linked in one single place.

  • I was going through my PC today and found this screen from my very first warrior on my original account.

    A really cool piece from ~2006 Marhan's Grotto.

    Here you can see more recent picture of such beauty ;)

    But how come that screen doesn't show gold value? was there some update later on :D

  • Here you can see more recent picture of such beauty ;)

    But how come that screen doesn't show gold value? was there some update later on :D

    A beauty indeed!

    That's actually a very good question!

    I am truly not sure why there is no gv, this was straight from my hard drive from some 16 years ago haha.

    This is shortly after the release of Factions, so that I do not know haha :)

  • Post by Kabong ().

    This post was deleted by the author themselves ().
  • Just noticed a hole in the summary chart above.

    Why didn't you ask?

    (Sorry, messed it up the 1st time I tried to post.)

    Turns out OP wants an example of a hammer with non-max DMG in the pre-nerf range, so that spot remains unfilled, in case anyone can help