Get 8 adrenalin charges with spear: +33% adrenaline VS +33% attack speed

Neutral_CH · June 20, 2024 at 7:21 PM

In view of the fact that any attack would be successful with a javelin, i was wondering which single boost would be the most suitable to quickly reach 8 charges of adrenalin.

Spear: attack speed = 1,5 sec. (1,5 sec = 1 adrenalin charge)
+33% attack speed: (1,5 sec x 0,66 = 0,99 sec for 1 adrenalin charge) (0,99 sec x 8 = 7,92 secs. for 8 adrenalin charges)
+33% adrenalin: (1,5 sec = 1,33 adrenalin charge) (8:1,33 = 6,015... ) (1,5 sec x 6,015... = 9,0225.. secs for 8 adrenalin charges)

Is my calculation right?

Marty Silverblade · June 21, 2024 at 1:32 AM Official Post

8 and 9 seconds respectively, so yes aside from the rounding errors.

Neutral_CH · June 21, 2024 at 2:46 AM

Precisely, in terms of roundness, i was wondering about adrenalin. There's no precision on the wiki. It's a per-charge scale, in other words, either 1 charge, or zero if you miss the attack. So, do you really gain 1.33 charge and after 3 attacks, do you gain 3.99 charge or would that be rounded up to 4? I'll have to test this further.

Marty Silverblade · June 21, 2024 at 3:50 AM Official Post

Adrenaline is measured in two units: strikes and points. When you hit with an attack you gain 1 strike, which is equivalent to 25 points. So it is possible to gain partial strikes, but then the question turns to the points. Now that you mention it I'm not 100% sure how it handles rounding; I was thinking in theory rather than practice. A couple of potentially relevant asides:

-You can also gain points from other sources, such as being hit. In practice any rounding errors may become irrelevant once you've taken damage.
-The adrenaline cost of a skill is not always an exact number of strikes. Penetrating Chop, for example, is listed at 5a (=125 points) but actually costs only 120 points.

Red Fireball · June 22, 2024 at 7:05 AM

yes, adrenaline isn't rounded to strikes, but to points. means you can get to situations, where some ... just isn't enough. the -33% adrenaline will only yield +8 points due to that, so three hits will just not be the same as 4 hits without the extra adrenaline. so as long as accounting just for attacks it makes the extra adrenaline again less attractive.

for time there is some quantization as well, but it is more precise than the adrenalin one, so rounding will be less of an issue.

the next question would be what you do with the 8 charges of adren then. if your adren gets lost or shall be used for the same skill again you would have to cut any leftover adren after reaching the 8adren goal to get your time and not use the average time as on your calculus.

Neutral_CH · June 22, 2024 at 8:36 PM

Basically i like this build:

OQGjUimKKTDZYFievlpbXFAh7YA Spear Master: 8 + 1 Command: 10 Leadership: 12 +1 +3 (Asuran Scan for anti-blind and skills to avoid attacks).

I'm reluctant to play the new elite PvE, i find it powerful for sure, but boring to play, a bit like ST in Rtl. I also prefer to have no constraints on incantation time and maintenance outside combat.

I was looking for a way to play SY with Heroic Refrain. Since i can't use Focused Anger at the same time, i was calculating these differences to reach 8 adrenaline. Even if Heroic Refrain slows me down during its 1sec incantation (which i don't like with this elite).

In short, Natural Temper sucks in this case i prefer to increase my attack speed instead + For Great Justice (Make Your Time reloads too slowly and To the Limit depends too much on enemies). I'm still building but i'm not satisfied with this PvE elite

Edit: For now, i'll play that. Although the obligation to take They're on Fire still bothers me

OQGjUimKKTn19YieXF1YAh7YubA Spear Master: 8 + 1 Command: 10 + 1 Leadership: 12 +1 +3

manuS · June 24, 2024 at 1:02 PM

You can get attack speed from pcons. But you cant get more adrenaline from it.

Neutral_CH · June 24, 2024 at 1:22 PM

Quote from manuS

You can get attack speed from pcons. But you cant get more adrenaline from it.

The aim was to do it without outside influence. And i prefer to stay old-school, with no consumables (except some run, chest run).

But i'll take a ROJ hero and another with Searing Flames (for They're on Fire) . Except VS Destroyers, which are immune to burning.

Red Fireball · June 25, 2024 at 5:23 AM

why stand your ground? on all allies it will be capped by sy - just for yourself? or to cover the time in between sy?

how about two heroes with "inspirational speech"?

or one hero with "dark fury"?

Neutral_CH · June 25, 2024 at 9:21 AM

Stand your Ground, to counter the -20 armor of Aggressive Refrain and possibly if SY is not active on allies (not possible gain adrenaline -> Soothing Images for example or blind or block attacks)

Inspirational Speech, no self target.

Dark Fury, not enough heroes using attacks and adrenalin (1 maximum in the group). And with group full humans you have to convince a player to equiped it and play it well.

After that, as i said, i'm playing this for now, but like the Magic cards deck, it's only by testing the deck that you can see what changes need to be made. The build will surely change. However, the first SY build posted is definitive.

I'm a bit rusty, i had erased my Para a long time ago. I invented the first builds to farm the Sword of the Dead in HM solo in early 2007 and others things (farm FoW, Vermins, etc). I had also made some youtube videos, deleted around 2009, seen 50k-60k. These were the builds that served as the basis for PvX at the time. So i know the Para very well but i'm still not satisfied with my current build.

Red Fireball · June 25, 2024 at 11:16 AM

but the armor penalty of aggressive refrain is bugged. it shall not lower your armor rating if you do not have any other armor buffs. but better just play war and take lions comfort 😅

Neutral_CH · June 25, 2024 at 11:56 AM

I hadn't been paying attention, i'll rectify the build. It must be said that i deleted my old para when they have too many skill nerfs including Aggressive Refrain which i used to play all the time back in the day. Ty.

Neutral_CH · June 27, 2024 at 9:36 PM

OQGjUimKKT+i9Yien1XFAh7YubA Spear Master: 9 + 1 Command: 9 + 1 Leadership: 12 +1 + 3. counter blind version. More balance.

Neutral_CH · July 7, 2024 at 1:10 AM

Finaly i prefer this ->

OQGkUim5ZhyEGWPmo3Z9VBQ4Om7G

Spear Master: 8 + 1 Command: 9 + 1 Motivation: 5 Leadership: 12 +1 + 3.

Finaly i prefer it like this, even if i don't have time to take a piss or grab a beer from the fridge without having to start all over again

justice · July 22, 2024 at 4:52 PM

Spear of Lightning

"Find Their Weakness!"

"Go for the Eyes!"

"Save Yourselves!"

"There's Nothing to Fear!"

Focused Anger

"Can't Touch This!"

"Don't Trip!" / Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor / (elective skill)

Spear Mastery: 12+4

Leadership: 9+1

Command: 9

Get a shield with -20% blind duration and the rune Clarity. "Cant Touch This!" will block throw dirt and lightning touch while your double -20% will reduce other sources by 2-4 seconds. Most blind is 5-10 seconds.

Get 3 spears with fire/lighting/cold mods.

Spike with 1/2/3 stacked up and 1/3 otherwise. Buff with the defensive shouts.

If you were wondering, Spear of Lightning spike with the 2 shouts can crit 60 armor rating foes for like 150 and another 100 for deep wound. Important for when dealing with pesky healers.

Give your blood hero Mark of Fury. Easy adrenaline and cracked armor for dropping targets.

If you can afford it, get some Essence of Celerity. IAS/IMS/Recharge Reduction streamlines a paragon so much. You don't have to pop it for casual gameplay but for vanqs its wonderful.

Neutral_CH June 21, 2024 at 2:46 AM