New campaign for Guild Wars 1, we can make it happen if there is a will.

  • 1. It won't happen. And I will list details in the rest if the numbers.

    2. Not enough player base, you would need to get rid of botters and gold sellers. Tell how you plan to combat that.

    3. Ncsoft dropped gw. Doubt you would gain interest with them.

    4. Lack of artists, etc. I would love to be a moderator, but it's an old game. Most are interested in newer things.

    5. Legal - things would need to go through that and the other divisions.

    6. Financial - may be a lot more cost than any realizes. A LOT goes into it. Look at the credits as part of the information.

    7. Stopping the abuse of accounts. One in game has 50 and trolls with several accounts.

    8. Stopping the hacking that is not secured enough.

    I Am sure there is more, but I don't think that you may understand much. Much goes into a game. I was in beta of Secret

    Ugh can not remember rest and they discussed their issues. They took my advice. Even were able to do expansion.

    So I understand that games can be trouble. There's a lot more to it than just a snap for an expansion or even expecting something like that - so soon.

    A lot goes on that's not known.

    It just won't happen.

    It's not happened on the countless other times that people have tried this.

    I don't see any difference.


    Use the serenity prayer.

    Accept what you cannot change and deal with it, instead of begging on a lost hopeless dream.

    Be happy that it even runs.

    People like me, can't enjoy marvel heroes as that shut down. I don't want to see this shut down, because of ammeture and Immature actions.

    Also, don't call me a troll when you lack experience with their wikis, etc., That I participated in. I don't have to threaten you, your actions betray that of a kid. I have been playing 11 years And gained other experience that I learned to accept. I still offer, but that's all I do.

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit:


  • Though we have plans to tackle some of the points you have mentioned and a lot of it is answered in the main post. I can not make the main post five pages detailing everything as that is not needed here or now. That is for the core group to manage and take forward when we reach the petition stage.

    We are looking for MBAs, FEs and BEs to help us improve the strategy when we take this to NCSOFT.

    I have already mentioned, this is about the fans and if the want it. The question is also very clear and it is a YES and NO question.


    Voting YES and then expecting that someone from NCSOFT/ANET will make calls to individuals and ask them who they want on the development team is simply unreasonable and will never happen. Some might give this demand other names but I am not going to ridicule it, as it can be something that a individual player may want.


    Discussing the technical details, codes, artists, issues with bots, gold sellers and account abusers has no meaning to what we intend to achieve. All these things get self addressed when something like materializes. The prime example is WoW Classic. It is for ANET to get it done if we can persuade them to do so. To succeed we need to come together as a group to take this forward or we can keep debating things that have no relevance to our cause.


    The idea is quite simple; get the player support if there and take a strong proposal to them with a well qualified and educated team and let them decide. No one here is trying to make their own game using anything related to the GW code as you had presumed in one of your posts on Discord.


    If you can get this shut down based on what I have described above, then this might not be the right place for it anyways. Everyone who votes "YES" should really think it over as you can also vote "NO". If you vote "YES" and want to join the core group, most welcome if you have the kind of expertise needed. If you vote "NO", we accept and respect your opinion. Voting "YES" with a pessimistic follow up lengthy message is a contradiction to your voting "YES" as the main post clearly requests for your positive support or criticism. Constructive criticism is always welcome.


    Lastly, no one is begging here anything from anybody. This is simply a business proposal from the players who also have strong backgrounds in the corporate world to the concerned executives at NCSOFT/ANET. I am not sure if the previous petitions had a core group with a basic strategy well planned.

  • Post by Ariyen ().

    This post was deleted by Kevin ().

  • I'm going to counter your points as I see them. I'm willing to open up discussion here since multiple POV's will be able to think about "issues" that we might not have seen before.


    1. Saying it won't happen never made anything happen. You cannot go to a company already thinking it won't happen.

    2. Our player base might not be what it used to be yet there are still some active players. Then again indeed it wouldn't be enough to fully operate the game and make it profitable. So what would you do? Get a petition like this going gather people IE a snowball effect. Then once you're finally there and gather enough people by immense time of dedication you go and think about your options. For instance you would give every GW2 account GW1 prophecies for free. People who'm have never played might actually start playing and there might be a profit. You cannot clearly bring this to NCSOFT as of yet. Since you do not have the numbers nor the manpower to actually bring anything to the table. But we're at the start I mean you have to start somewhere. Again it will take time but it will grow. I'm here to give it a shot at least.

    3. NCSOFT hasn't dropped GW. If they truly dropped GW we would not be able to play I mean look at WILDSTAR it got dropped as of today it is closing down soon and that is because it had an even lower pop than GW and higher running cost. So if anything NCSOFT has not dropped GW they still earn enough I still see new players buying GW it is still going strong. Not as strong as it used to but still strong enough.

    4. You know what is an old game? WoW! And you know what they have? Artists! Ooh and not to forget a team that is now working on legacy servers. All these people who'm wouldn't be interested in an "old" game. And not to forget that they merged with activision a publisher many times worse than NCSOFT. Look at the revenue numbers of game under activision and then check out ncsofts revenue per game and then say which one has the bigger chance to open a legacy program. Even with wildstar being taken down might make it an even bigger possibility with one of their absolute best sellers to return to the scene.

    5. Legal would truly be your last issue. You do not go to a company with an idea and bring it to legal first. You get it heard by the departments you want. Your best in is always marketing in a company. Why? Well if you get marketing on board they will practically sell your idea to the top without you needing to sweat as hard. Trust me your pitch would still be nerve wrecking and hard to do but easier if you get in through marketing. They would be able give you the numbers you'd need. They know their clientele and have the info you need, to show them that the game might actually be profitable. Once you got this rolling and the top would be on board then you look at your legality. And if I think to know anything about this, is that a company like Anet and a publisher like NCSOFT will do anything to get through the legal issues if they are on board. You cannot look at end-game problems if your just at the start. Hell try to solo urgoz as a level one it would be the same thing.

    6. The financial issue is nor isn't an issue as of yet. You do not have the numbers you need to calculate if the game will be profitable or not. You do not have the margins yet. Nor any chance calculations. Unless we do what we're doing we will never be able to make these calculations. But we're still miles away from this issue. And again looking at Wildstar if there was a financial issue GW wouldn't be around anymore.

    7. Didn't they recently add a report system? And again this is an issue that can be solved fairly easily but for a future date. And you will always have trolls.

    8. Hacking is a problem in any online game and if you fix it they will find a new way. If this movement gets enough attention and GW starts to rise again there will be a team delivering new content and fixing backdoor.


    I would like to thank you for your input and if you do not agree with me I'm always open for discussion. :)

    I do understand that making a game isn't: "poof" new expansion for you.

    And this might take months even years to achieve what we would like to achieve with this movement, it could also be that nothing will be accomplished. But if we don't try there never will be a chance. And I'd rather want a slim chance than not even trying at all. Again the industry quote of "You think you do, but you don't" showed that a small chance is worth fighting for.

  • 1. Saying it won't happen. Yes, because countless other proposals same as your proposal went through what they did. It was legal that stopped it. 😒

    2. You don't need 'numbers'. That didn't stop other more popular games from shutting down, including Ncsoft's City of Heroes. I did play on that one, until it was closed. I was getting use to the game system. Thought it was neat. It didn't have botters or gold sellers like gw does. Numbers don't matter, financial does.

    3. I don't see it on their site. Do you? 😂 It's Arenanet that's hosting gw on the same servers as gw2. That's why it's still active. Not ncsoft. So, main points on ncsoft still stand as corrected.

    4. You basically told on discord of no artists. I know from discussions and other information that their artists for gw not gw2. Didn't stay around. Some that I know that did work, have gone on to other jobs. Again, point still stands of needing artists that can do gw style as others have done.

    5. Legal is their first with gw as to what can and can't be done. How I know? Because of work talk with ncsoft, etc. In emails. It was they'd have to consult legal. Same with suggestions that I had, etc. To expand team and increase player base. Again, my point corrected on this.

    6. Financial is not an issue? How amusing... Okay, so it would not be an issue for like say a fan film, etc.? How would you get people involved, if you don't intend in on financial talks? Just even for a company to own another. There is financial. It's always a priority here. It is the USA. Same place that Arenanet resides. With about any business, there's always financial. Even in getting a job. People find out the starting pay, etc. Same with digital artists, designers, etc. I have seen many comment about this. So, financial is always a priority here... That's just honest truth of how America works.

    7. They fixed their report system not add it. It's been there for a while. Just had been broken and not everyone will report bots, gold sellers, etc. When they farm in areas that no one plays. And when they give things like trims, items - especially rare ones, even armbraces.... No one is going to want to report. Most have gotten use to it. Even though the botters and gold sellers actually damage the game. They claim to help it.

    8. It would be prudent to prevent hacking like blocking the ips, etc. Before New players, but... Just a new form of hacking is happening and it is getting players to give out information that can be used to get into accounts. 2f cannot prevent all accounts, because of Change in email or phone, etc.... Same with people allowing remote access... Key loggers, etc.


    Core thing - detailed planning of suggestions, etc..that would and could gain interest. An ability to still be able to be self reliant. Involvement of them. Actual advertising and promotion. Even involving twitch and YouTube hosts and reddit and here. A revamp of the wiki, turning it into sites limiting to only certain ones to edit it and no discussion, but one page for suggestions and no bug reports. That goes directly to staff. Staff can inform the editors or add themselves the notes of bugs. I would suggest the sites to be used that could have this to work. Using their current theme on their main site. This would cut out any and all abuse of wiki administration.

    No discord, that's too much high maintenance and real time discussion always going on. Leave it to players only.


    Pretty high maintenance that could be costly... Thing would be, would it be worth for the end revenue.


    Also, have a copyright that no other site can copy their work at all even to sell for profit without consulting legal. Other words, a collaboration that could benefit them (anet). Like put a stop to and prevent gold sellers.

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit:

  • Ariyen You need to stop being rude, now. You've been rude through out all of this Just because you don't like it doesn't mean you can act this way.

    I am not being rude. Just honest, but I can be... 😈 😇 And FYI I never said I didn't like it. So, you must be reading something else. I raised 8 main points that I Know are issues. That's still not answered. Also have made suggestions that could be considered. So, I don't get what is rude.

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit:

  • I am not being rude. Just honest, but I can be... 😈 😇 And FYI I never said I didn't like it. So, you must be reading something else. I raised 8 main points that I Know are issues. That's still not answered. Also have made suggestions that could be considered. So, I don't get what is rude.

    You haven't made any suggestions that could be considered. All you've talked about is why it is impossible. How depressing that is. :thumbdown:
    Try to think even remotely positively, and if you can't do that, then just stop saying anything.
    You're upsetting people and you need to quit. :(
    And also, what? The main points have been answered by Mastinoo .

    Edited once, last by Nightblade ().

  • Ariyen


    I see your points and I do agree with you on getting involvement on youtube, twitch, ect.

    Yet you keep bouncing on issues that are further down the line. As I stated the financial issue is not something we should think about untill we gather atleast 500 votes to start a petition. Yes stating that there are problems with gold sellers and bots and if it will be profitable are things we need to hear and they will be noted. But we’re not at the stage yet to allready have solutions for them. Stage 1 means getting the word spread out there. Start with 500 votes on a poll and then start a petition. Once the petition hits let’s say 5k signatures then we start to think about the issues you represent. Why then because then you can ask an invested community of people who’m want the same thing. And once you get the petition rolling more people will give their insight on the issues you state and problems will be easier to solve. Yet I do not understand why you would be so negative towards this post. It seems as if you have a bet that gw1 should never have another expansion / love toward it. I understand that we may not think the way you do nor do you think it will succeed but let us give it a try atleast. And if you do have some inside knowledge I would happily be a listening ear to that. But again the issues you stated are noted and will be spoken of when the time is there to do so. I would like to thank you for your input! And if there’s more we need to know do be sure to tell us!


    I’m sorry for any grammatical errors and/or typo’s I woke up 30 minutes ago wich is around 2am and am going back to sleep now.

  • Mastinoo see, it'd have to be one of the first things. It's 8 central where I am in America right now. Arenanet is American. Most companies and jobs, etc. Rely on financial first. It's like that with any type of job here. Without financial, you get no where... I know. . have been low enough to sell items just to make ends meet.

    It's a catch 22. You need money to get a car house, etc. . Transportation to job or even internet. Nothing really is free. You need a job to have money to get these things. So , even right now you need money here to do a start up company even gaming. I looked into the gaming side a bit. You can get a loan, but you have to pay it back or it hurts credit score... (Yet another thing I am learning on) and with no or little score and low income barely hanging on... You can't get a loan for a business, etc. Even to hire people to work for you to collaborate with Arenanet. Everything here revolves around job and money. ... You have a high credit score... It's easy. Everyone starts out at zero credit score.

    So, they would probably hear proposal. If like, there'd be discussion of financial. You would have to be prepared. Not think it's something to do later. Many companies do this. It's a normal business practice here.

    You would have to know the loans, the pros and cons, etc. There's been turn downs at a local company, because of no financial ideas, etc.

    It's not specific. It's common.

    So, it's not a later thing... As much as anyone would like. I would like that with things, but it doesn't work out. :-(

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit:

  • Ariyen I understand that money talks. Trust me I paid my own way through college and finishing up my MBA while I’m working full-time as a business account manager for a telecom company. If you read the main post again you will see that EMPEROR has mentioned finances as the most important core issue for this. That is why our core team consists of MBAs, FEs and several BEs to get this done right. Now why would I state that the financial issue would be spoken of a little further down the line then? Well gathering votes will take enough time let alone a petition. As you can imagine I don’t have time like I used to back in my teens. So before, I would spend time on making financial calculations which do take a lot of effort. I would want to be sure that there is enough interest of the community for me to be as dedicated as can be. But if I were to spend the time and we wouldn’t even get 500 votes it would be a waste of time. This is sad but true. Not just for me but for anyone involved.

    And if I think that 500 votes is a starting point to make calculations, what would Anet think? So there is enough time unless magically tomorrow we have 10k votes. Do not worry about the financial situation it will be sorted in due time. Ideas and calculations have already been made just not as in-depth as the need to be. But they will be before we would even knock on the door.

    For now we need public acknowledgement and support. So let’s get those votes. And fight as hell to get us that expansion.

  • So...


    I'm not a moderator and I have no power here. Some people know me, some people don't.

    I'm a guy who has played for a while and am more invested in this game than most.

    And I have 2 more cents to plunk down.


    It seems to me that no one here is completely right or completely wrong. Passions have been aroused and people have gotten excited. Lots of people have lots of important things to say about an important question. That's great, and it's because it means lots of people love this game. In that greatness, however, problems can arise when priorities aren't shared and people don't feel listened to. Ideas get trampled or ignored or shouted down.


    I think it's best for everyone to take a step back and a deep breath and reconsider why this thread was started and what our respective purposes are for posting here. As a group and community we need to organize this energy in the most useful way possible.


    Maybe what we need is not one place for all these different ideas and priorities. Maybe we need two, or three.

    Maybe votes for or against an expansion and comments related directly to those votes belong here.

    Maybe a different thread can be made for discussion of other matters or strategies related to a potential expansion that do not directly involve votes.


    I am simply suggesting organization. This will make the material contained in these threads more practical for its purpose. It will make for freer discussion of different topics because others will not be trampled or pushed to the side. I am not suggesting editing, silencing, suppressing, delaying, deferring or censoring anyone's thoughts or ideas. This just too broad a conversation being addressed from too many angles to be contained in one thread at this point.


    Like Mastinoo said, what is needed HERE is public acknowledgement, support and votes. I agree. Even if you vote against an expansion, that is still acknowledgement and votes. What we need ELSEWHERE is a different thread so that the discussions that have started and the ideas that have arisen in parallel with the original petition can be considered, explored and eventually incorporated into further efforts if this manages to get off the ground.


    A lot of words for a simple, obvious idea that can help everyone interested in this topic and its various facets all exist in perfect harmony.


    Ebony and Ivory.....

    (That's Stevie Wonder in case you're too young. YouTube it.)


    Thanks for reading. I'll be watching you. Please proceed with my best interests at heart <3.


    Kabong

  • Amount would mean little to nothing.. doesn't matter how many people like it. Look up the other petitions to get an idea as to how many fans would support. That's not the thing nor would show how many people would buy and many degrees means little versus experiences. I have had so much education that I have been turned down for lack of experience.

    I learned since. Age doesn't matter. What matters is learning what problems are and creating ideas and suggestions. That's the first step. A good deal of improvements to bring players back. Then show all of that and ask even in a poll. How many would support those changes. Not just an expansion in general that's being badly vague... It may gain support, but would leave many wondering where, etc. That could hurt and not gain those additional points. Why when with Any suggestions as I have done with companies... You have solutions. Like I suggested to some to help people in need that can't afford formula, etc. For parents. Tide helped wash the clothes. A college switched from using out dated email and chat to Google. Google created scholar.google.com , classroom.google.com and more. I helped. I still have a college email address. 😄

    So, having thought out plans that can help - works better than nothing and I would say this is more like a rough draft not completely thought out. If you want expansion, etc. Have contingency plans. Suggests that would include pvp improvements that could likely work, pve improvemets and additions. Willing to help show them that artists, etc. Would be paid for that financial is your expense as this is your suggestions. To help show how to rid of things ideas to improve the game in general. All laid out. Then get votes and take what you have to every location possible. Then go to Arenanet and NcSoft.

    Treat this As the suggestions etc. That could help. Not shooting people down, because they disagree with you. Often may be reasonable... Again. All can be towards contigency plans.

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit:

  • Thanks for the like, ariyen.

    I hope it means you will consider my suggestion in the future.


    Your subsequent post is a good example of one that may detract from the quality of the current thread but be more appropriate in a different "suggestion box" type thread designed for suggestions and discussions as described above.


    Best,

    Kabong (not a mod so I'll stop now)



  • I've tried to stay outside of this conversation for a while, but I'm going to step in now and clarify a few things:


    NCSoft hasn't had anything to do with Guild Wars since september 2015 - at that point, ArenaNet took over the publishing of both GW1 and GW2 - whilst ArenaNet is still owned by NCsoft, the direct involvement of NCsoft in operations have been cut since then.

    That's also the reason why the in-game shop closed, as that was being run by NCsoft.

    Does that mean that NCsoft doesn't care? Well, NCsoft is more focussed on Asia nowadays and ArenaNet has proven that they can handle running an MMO and the business side - so they're a bit more out of sight.


    For GW1 to get a new expansion, a few things would need to happen:

    - They'd need to train a new team to use the GW1 engine and tools - since most of their current team is working on GW2 and they need those people there - they won't remove people from GW2 to improve GW1.

    - The GW1-tools have been broken terribly and have been a nightmare to use for years. Joe Kimmes was responsible for adding the Balthazar weapons (it was a pet project of him) and it took him a very long time to get the tools to work at all - which is understandable, since those tools didn't get any use in the last 5 years.

    So, in order to fix those, they'd need a sizeable programming team to properly fix them and probably would need to build a few new ones.

    - Bill/Stephen have been trying to add new features (like the item rarity coloring, bigger bags), but it caused a lot of issues when they tried to implement it - I'm not sure if it's still coming, I sure hope so, but the GW1 engine is very old by now. Knowledge of it has lessened in the company (not only due to people leaving ArenaNet, because a ton of GW1 people still work there), but if you stop working on something you lose knowledge of the structure quickly (I'm a sysadmin/devops, I know what I'm talking about here :P).

    - If all of these hordes have been tackled with, new content would be possible - but it would take a year before anything would come of it, at the least. You'd need people to get used to the tools and software and that's something which takes a while. Since the live team was about 10 people, those were able to create sizeable content drops in the game, but those were rather small and released in bits.

    - Would it still be financially viable to create new content? Whilst I don't doubt that there are a lot of players and a lot of returning ones, I don't know about this. You'd need to train new support staff, hire a new team and train them, the costs to get everything working again and up to modern standards... it's going to be really expensive. GW hasn't had new content for years and the community, while still being sizeable, might not be big enough to support all of this.


    Once all those hordes have been passed, a new expansion might be feasible. But those are quite big hurdles.

    Should we get this big enough, I don't doubt things are possible - but we'd need A LOT of people to pull this off.


    We're here to offer the place to let you promote this and if we can we'll try to help, but this isn't an easy feat to pull off - remember that the original campaigns were made by about 50 employees in about a year - to get a return on that, you'd need to sell a lot.


    So, all in all: not impossible, but nearly. But there might be a small chance.


    What I think is more realistic is having a small live team again that can create some small content drops, perhaps and work on small improvements that the game still needs. That alone would be amazing for me and much more likely to happen.


    - Kevin

    Hi there! I'm the Guild Wars Legacy admin, feel free to contact me if you've got issues.

    :ass: Inquisitor Karinda :der: Sunspear Elke :mes:Librarian Amber

  • Kevin wrote:

    What I think is more realistic is having a small live team again that can create some small content drops, perhaps and work on small improvements that the game still needs. That alone would be amazing for me and much more likely to happen.


    - Kevin


    And I for one would be quite happy with that! Thanks for the very insightful input, Kevin.


    P.S. Do you think they will one day give us a good use for superfluous skill points and worthless XP? :cookie:

    Lose a minion, make a minion.

  • I'm all in favour of an expansion, would be great! I'm sure if you surveyed players, they would all say the same. It's a bit like getting a petition to keep the local pub open- 99% say they are in favour of it. 80% say they will use it. 10% actually use it, it loses money and closes down.


    As I pointed out earlier and echoed by Kevin, smaller bits would be much more likely to happen. An entire expansion would need a budget running into several millions as well as 1-2 years lead time, plus advertising, recruitment, etc so $10-$20m US Dollars as a bare minimum. To recoup that sort of cost needs sales of 1m copies. Let's face it, none of that is likely unless someone supporting this voting has very deep pockets. Is one of you called Musk? Until someone comes forward with some concrete proposals, a petition isn't going to get anywhere. Just look at the history of online petitions to see how little effect they have on gaming companies generally. Money talks.


    Additional dungeons in Tyria could be relatively easy using only Tyrian skills (Codex coding allows skill restrictions, so coding is there), Nm and HM exist, so it's then a question of what might drop from the end chest and then making the dungeon so you cannot SC it.


    And the very real issue is that 99% of players don't even know this site exists so you aren't going to get very far using this site. What you need is to push it using social media and build up a following backed with some hard cash and advertising spend- then you might get the company's attention.

  • Having read this thread, I've got to applaud the passion and enthusiasm, but if this was really a viable option, don't you think the owners of the game (whoever they may actually be at this point) have considered the economics and rejected this proposition? Much as we may care for the game, if spending money on GW1 does not hold out a realistic prospect of a decent financial return, then it simply won't happen.


    I've enjoyed playing this game since 2005, and still log on from time to time to do Nic quests. I simply don't expect any further development.

    [font="Times New Roman"]I will show you fear in a handful of dust.[/font]

  • Victory agree 💯%. I have seen so many similar and same petitions with zero real proposals,.details, etc. As I suggest... And they all failed... I have pointed out problems that I see and know from former and current gw sites. Some are shut down, etc. So of course not everyone is going to understand at all. Notice, no thoughts or solutions. Just complaints. These things have everything to do with expansion suggestion, etc. As all that's current will happen there as well....

    So, if the current can't be considered or solved.... There's no point continuing. If just vague suggestions is considered enough... There's tbh lack of experience.

    So, with that said... "A lot more needs to be planned out, before getting 'sound' votes." Not just another "I want an expansion!! I have people who want it who are developers". Codes, etc. Change. I don't think they know older code. Schools don't teach older codes, etc.

    I have a degree in networking, etc. Learned some on programming like visual basic etc. That's no longer used.

    So, I know things change. 😒

    Why I say this. Education isn't going to help in some areas without experience.... I have learned more on my own or be taught by others, than a school could teach. Experiences can help broaden the mind.

    If this was me, I would redo with details that could help even with the current problems, etc. And details of plan etc. That could counter most questions or problem points. Then get more sound votes.

    Other types of proposals and petitions that I have seen are more like that. (Subscribed to three petition sites at least.)

    Thanks.

    :heart: By the light of the fire and the sparkle of the stars, you came to realize the meaning of true love. - Lori B. :rit: