PRESEARING - ONE MONTH LATER

Well, it's almost a month since Forsaken Tunnels was added to Presearing Ascalon. Now that Tunnels of the Forsaken has been introduced to post, pre-searing is getting quiet again. Has been for a while, with a slow decline over the past week...

Was just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on the new additions to pre and whether it was good, great, or downright bad and horrible now that the old economy has gone to hell...

Anyone still holding on to those pre-FT items and wondering what's next? Does pre still hold interest, or is it time to move on?

Personally, I'm still enjoying pre-searing since it's so much easier to get to level 20 and achieve LDoA and doing it on multiple characters isn't such a grind anymore. Working on Survivor, and especially Legendary Survivor is still a drag, but manageable for sure with a little patience. Working on the title on a Dhumm character takes a little bit more planning and a whole lot of patience though...

Quote from PyroLobster

Almost everything that Pre was is now destroyed. Most of the restrictions that made it what it was are gone. LDoA is now pretty meaningless as its so easy to attain. You can play with a hero that has all skills. Gear limits are obliterated and items everybody worked hard for are now so suboptimal as to be worthless. Inscri weapons ruined the continuity of it being part of proph. Not surprised the hype disappeared so quickly. I was never a big Pre player but the changes are horrifically bad. It feels like a weird hybrid mix of all campaigns made my somebody throwing random ingredients at a recipe without understand what there are trying to make. Adding the dungeon is ok, maybe even even low req OS golds as a very rare reward for doing would have freshen it up nicely but what has now been created is awful. Saw the term on another thread and its perfect, Pre has been "post-ified". Looks to me like all changes where cheap hype to get everybody excited again but now the dust has settled what we have been left with sucks.

What is the point of Pre anymore when its now so similar to the rest of the game? It being different was its appeal wasn't it?

I would agree, the fact that pre was different from the main scenario was what appealed to most of the players that decided to stay or like myself, left multiple characters in pre-Ascalon for some relaxing farming and grind.

A player would have been thrilled picking this item up in pre even if it is almost practically useless:

And I can imagine getting a BD or two for this back in the days:

Now, they're just sitting on a long forgotten storage character and even if I were to donate them to a new player, they'd probably cancel trade...

But that's how developers work... They don't really care much for in-game trading or markets... All they care about is actual sales of the game and all other add-ons. And to maintain the hype, they would have to give the new players something to scream about... Guess for pre, it's max gold items... And to continue the hype into post, crysta, krytan, etc were introduced as drops in the new dungeon.

Was the same when Nightfall was launched... In order for new players to be able to catch up with other players who had already played through Prophecies as well as Factions and were already geared to the nines, they decided to introduce inscribable items to make it easier for players starting in Nightfall to catch up to the rest.

I'm not too bothered by the current drops as I'm not a collector or playing the trade market these days... Just gaming to have fun and relax and be happy with the few items I can make use of... There are a few items that I keep an eye out for in the market only because I like the skin. Not really bothered about req, inscribable, OS, or even prenerf if I can afford them and they have utility.

Incredibly, I'm currently still stuck in pre levelling multiple characters because I do so enjoy the less hectic pixel life there...

Quote from Aeronwen

Players who come for the novelty are not going to stay longterm. Players who enjoyed Pre as it was are going to be pissed off.

What's the point, why change what was unique to be just the same as everywhere else? It is lazy and destructive.

Only time will tell if new or returning players are willing to stay for the long term in a game that is over 20-years old... As a returning player, I've been playing mostly around starter areas as well as doing some of the campaign missions and messing around with builds, etc to get used to the different classes once again. It has been slightly over three months and I'm still enjoying the vast experiences as well as flexibility in builds and team setups that Guild Wars provides. I'm not even following the Zaishen quests or entered an elite dungeon, which most end-game players tend to grind due to the lack of new contents until recently.

Pre-Ascalon population has dropped by half since the introduction of Forsaken Tunnels, which doesn't mean that the novelty has worn off since there's a much bigger world out there with three campaigns to explore. New players who bought the game in April would have a lot of content to go through unless they get stuck grinding Tunnels of the Forsaken although I doubt that is the case considering it's probably quite tough and requires a decent team setup with/without heroes and consumables which come later in the game. I haven't even done the quests for the dungeon yet so I stand corrected but I highly doubt a new player would spend much time messing around an elite dungeon when there's so much more content to play through.

Returning players like myself 'might have' all the skill sets, heroes, as well as consumables to farm the new dungeon IF they still have the means and in-game funds and here's the catch...

I completed GWAMM in 2007 and by the time I achieved the title, I was burnt-out. Coupled with the fact that ANet had nerfed drops earlier, there wasn't much to play for since I lost the opportunity to farm for my favourite req 8 skins. Yes, I could easily have gone to the market and bought what I needed but Guild Wars being my first MMO, I really wanted to have the items as personal drops regardless of the grind involved. Before quitting, I donated my stacks of ectos and shards to friends in order to help those with little play time get their Obsidian armor. I returned to the game recently, not poor, since I still had about 500 plats, but not able to purchase much in terms of consumables due to highly inflated prices.

Thankfully, I still had a small collection of req 8s which I sold here in Legacy and am now sitting comfortably on 1500 arms. Casual players returning to the game would struggle first of all with finding the right party due to a player base that is still growing or lacking due to most veterans running with heroes+consumables, as well as not having enough funds to purchase said items.

Apart from the Forsaken Tunnels in pre-searing, does anyone with 20-years of experience and time playing this game do PUGs regularly these days? And even then, there's Devona which personally, I am trying to create a reliable setup where I can play through the dungeon at level 16+ on two accounts without dying.

PUGs are horrible for Dhumm gamers as I found out multiple times, hence me being stuck in pre but I do have a level 20 that tries to group. However, due to my location in South-East Asia, the population has dropped a lot since the beginning of April so I am currently spending more time on my low levels farming anniversary items. Maybe most players are doing the same and we'll be able to find groups again after the event ends.... After all, birthday cupcakes are a good source of in-game revenue...

As PyroLobster mentioned earlier above, maintaining low req OS gold drops would have been better since it would increase participation from veterans as well due to the desire to find the most desirable as well as highest stats possible for items. Handing out max inscribable brings pre into the current post-level thus destroying a 20-year old legacy.

But as I mentioned above as well, ANet/2 weeks aren't concerned about the in-game market... That's for the player base to adjust in accordance to demand and supply. What the current 4 developers working on new and existing contents are probably concerning themselves with is the volume of sales from Reforged and whether it is worth their time and effort to continue maintaining and developing a game that I imagine, they love and enjoy playing as well.

Has anyone playing the market ever asked themselves whether a game developer actually cares if a prenerf req 7 15^50 max damage Crystalline Sword sells for a million arms? Point the developer to such a trade and he would probably roll eyes and bring up a no requirement max damage weapon just to show us who's in charge. It's hypothetical and it's not like such a trade exists, but I can definitely say that it could happen and that's the scary part about Guild Wars these days.

It's ludicrous what some items are worth these days, and when single word names are being sold for hundreds or sometimes thousands of arms, it begs the question: 'So how and where do players actually get their arms from?'

I've always seen Guild Wars as a fun and interesting game with a lot of potential due to the high volume of content as well as drop items. I never thought of the game as pay-to-win or pay-to-standout even though I've noticed that it is possible these days with real world purchases of items, etc. Personally, I can't comment on the legality or morality of such transactions if the developers themselves know of such online sites and activities and take no action.

Since retiring from Guild Wars around the beginning of 2008, I've played may other online games where PTW was the only way to go so if Reforged ends up moving in the same direction, it's not a huge bother as I'm still enjoying the game as a current casual gamer. However, COVID hit us hard and I regret the money I spent for those other games I played... Sure was painful to delete accounts where I had played for 5 years or more and spent between USD10-20k on each but life goes on.

I just hope that those that do make real world purchases realise that it's all just pixels and at the end of the day, it's the developer who pushes the ON/OFF switch. As a website/forum dedicated to GW, it would be good to hopefully be able to reach out to the current developers and provide feedback as well as ideas rather than being critical of new developments or contents. I can understand why some players dislike or even hate what's been added recently because I felt the same way when they nerfed the drops in the past and introduced inscribable items.

Also, as I mentioned before on a separate thread, some of the collections I've seen are priceless no matter what happens in the future... No new or returning player will ever be able to emulate what you have achieved so be proud of the collections. If the pride comes from how much cash you have spent mustering the collection and are now livid due to the new content crashing item prices then I suggest taking a break from the game and reevaluating your gaming needs.

I've only been back for three months ~ a month on my main character repeating Young Heroes of Tyria in Hard Mode so often that I have 10 books in storage to turn in. A month spent in Shing Jea Island levelling a Dhumm warrior that never seems to make it past the Nagas or Crimson Skulls at Haiju Lagoon. And finally, a month in pre which I enjoy the most due to the skill limitations as well as small and stable community.

However, I'm not a social person and prefer to keep to myself when gaming... I haven't spoken to anyone apart from the usual hellos and thank yous during PuGs and trade nor applied to join any active guilds due to my experience and knowledge of the game so I tend to just do a bit of farming as well as running around on my multiple characters, try to survive, die, rinse and repeat...

Most of the games I've quit recently still have a fairly active population but in this age, the attrition tends to be extremely high as well as fast due to the development of new and better games which have better graphics and also player control. However, even though the population of these games are only about 15-20% of what they used to be, the developers still provide a monthly developer's update to announce any future developments.

This is something which I find lacking with Guild Wars even from launch since betas were mostly closed and only a select few were allowed to provide any form of feedbacks or be heard. The lack of communication started from the very beginning ~ probably due to the huge success of the game just after a rival game (WoW) was launched. From then on, it seemed to me that ANet was just pushing campaign after campaign at the community in order to make the most of the hype.

Bear in mind that the games I am talking about involve a lot of in-game purchases so even if the population remained stagnant for a long period of time, they would have the resources and manpower to listen to grievances or ideas from the playing community. The same can be said about subscription-based games like WoW.

If I haven't heard or read wrong, future development and maintenance of Guild Wars Reforged is now handled by only 4 individuals. I doubt they actually have time to listen to the player community when there are more urgent matters which need to be dealt with, e.g. financial stability, game improvements, potential content development and upgrade, etc. However, it shouldn't stop us, the players, from reaching out. First, by thanking them, followed by new ideas and feedbacks.

This is something that GWLegacy can do even though there is currently a huge divide amongst forum members here regarding the recent updates and content. As I mentioned before, GW is a game for all, be they new, veterans, or returning. There should be a little something for everyone, including for the team of developers, so choices have to be made. Is the lack of transparency due to an overworked team of developers? Or is it actually due to the constant gripe and lack of proper feedback from a playing community that feels entitled?

Aeronwen As moderators on this forum, I would presume that you have enough knowledge of the people who have contributed the most to this website as well as GWWiki and are able to assist if ever communications were to be made. In addition, you are also part of a larger and active alliance which shares passion for the game, both in pre as well as post.

First step of course is making contact...

Bit of warning though... We are no longer in the 2005-2007 period... There are now various means through which players are able to communicate with each other and everyone has their own agenda as well as ideas, and GWLegacy is just one of them. Finding someone who can communicate across all channels would be ideal.

I had my bad moments with GW a long time ago... Anet/2weeks can do a rollback all the way to 2005 if they like, or just tweak whatever they feel like tweaking if it suits their purse strings... I'm just here to enjoy the game as well as try to get as many characters through the three campaigns... If I ever manage to get them out of the starter areas...

Thanks for the info and clarification Good to hear there may be more than just the four and that there's also an art and creative team.... Means more new content or possibly additional/upgraded bling to the game.

Am a little concerned about the mobile version though as it tends to come with some form of ads or payments but if it gives the developers a huge boost in numbers, so be it...

Kaslim I think I can sneak in another 7-10 minutes of gameplay now...

Quote from Aeronwen

Marcus Ferret Way way back I used to communicate on semi regular basis with a couple of Anet CM's. Whilst they were extremely helpful with my art competitions on Guru and arranged some rather lovely prizes I am afraid my well thought out, logically expressed and ultimately correct views on the changes that were made to gameplay were politely ignored^^

Since then I have been heavily involved with the developement of some other games and my view is that devs should stick to their own vision and not be too interested in, or influenced by, players (except me ofc)!

I don't have any access to ANET these days and I dont seek it but I have the same right as anyone else to air my views on the unwelcome changes to a beloved pasttime.

Servants of Fortuna & Servants of Fortuna [Victrix] had open communications as well with ANet in those days but it was mostly on betas or skill balancing since Victrix was heavily involved in the GvG arena.

For PvE, there weren't really much communications except during events with Gaile and also that one time when ectos dropped to a few hundred in gold value due to a botched update and players were swarming to the rare material merchant... Reported the bug before it crashed the entire market system....

It's rare for a game developer to respond to gamers where PvE is concerned unless it is something game-breaking, e.g the 3-modded items.

As clients of the game, you are definitely right that we should air our ideas and thoughts to the developers whenever the opportunity arises and it is definitely always better when the gaming population is still small-ish...

Guild Wars Reforged is still in beta and this 20+ year old game still has one of the best entertainment value as well as skill balancing... Whatever comes next, we will all have to learn to adapt just like irl...